Hawk G4 vs. Eclipse

[RocketMan]

Greetings everyone,

I am going to be purchasing a high-quality scroll saw and have narrowed my choices down to the Hawk G4 and the Eclipse.

Other than the price difference, I can't seem to identify many reasons to select one over the other. I have never used (or even seen in person) the Eclipse although I only live 2 1/2 hours from the factory, so It might be possible to take a trip one day and try one out. A disadvantage of the Eclipse is that it requires a tool at the lower blade clamp. On the other hand, I get the impression from newsgroup postings that the Eclipse has less vibration than the G4. Both companies are supposed to have excellent customer service.

Is there anybody that has used both saws (or knows people that have) that can give me a reason to favor one saw over the other? They both seem to be highly regarded.

Thanks for your help,
-Alan

[foneman]

First off, I have never tried or used an Eclipse. Last week I did drive 180 miles one way to try a G4 that was for sale and ended up coming home without it. I will just explain some of the things I did not like in comparison to my RBI 220vs. The "pitman arm" that drives the lower parallel arm is nylon with a bushing on the connection to the arm. My 220 has bearing on both ends and is machined aluminum. At top speed the arm that supports the dust hose and hold down vibrated more than I liked, even though the table was not vibrating as much. The vibration of the arm was very distracting. The G4 had a speed approximately 2/3 full speed that vibrated more than the rest. Those are the things I didn't like and the reason I did not buy it. As far as comparing to my 220, I would not have traded straight across for the G4.

There is no way I want to make anyone think I am bashing the G4. These are just my opinions and observations on just one G4.

I recommend you try both machines before you decide because everyones like and dislikes are different.

Good luck with your decision!
John

[Woodbutcher68]

I've seen the Eclipse demonstrated at Scrollsaw Trade shows and was impressed. If I ever sell my boat, I will be ordering one.

[RocketMan]

foneman,

Thanks for your response. I have never seen the Hawk G4, but I did try the RBI Hawk 220VS at a woodworking show. It was a very nice machine. I assumed that the G4 was a "new and improved" next-generation version of the earlier scroll saws. Call me old-fashioned, but when a manufacturer starts replacing metal components with plastic, and replaces bearings with bushings, I get a little nervous, especially in a machine that is considered among the best on the market . It makes me wonder where else the manufacturer is trying to save pennies.

Maybe I should take another look at the 220VS.

On the other hand, from what I have read, most G4 owners love their scroll saws and besides, the saw does have a six-year warranty, which is excellent.

-Alan

[minowevie]

I looked at the Hawks. and was pretty interested in them, Butttt, I think I would deffenetly get or at least try the Eclipse.there is some things I dont like. but what I loved, is the straightness of the blade. Evie

[RocketMan]

minowevie,

Can you tell me what you don't like about the Eclipse?

just curious,
Alan

[lucky788scroller]

I have test drove the eclipse , and it is definatly a smooth, vibration saw. At the Fox Chapel open house the Eclipse was set up on a wood floor in a 100 year old warehouse. One would think the saw would walk across the room, but it stayed put, and ran real smoothly at any speed. The blade travels straight up and down, unlike almost every other saw. Blade changing fast would take a little getting used to, but again something one quickly picks up on.I am so used to my yella saw clamping, but thats because I do it a batrillion times.If you want a quiet, smooth running saw, I would definatly pick the Eclipse over the G4.
I am curious though, what was the deciding factor that narrowed it down to those two. The Excaliber gets great reviews, definatly a saw worth considering. Dale

[RocketMan]

Originally Posted by lucky788scroller

I am curious though, what was the deciding factor that narrowed it down to those two. The Excaliber gets great reviews, definatly a saw worth considering. Dale

Dale,
I have a shop filled with made-in-Taiwan power tools (mostly Jet and Bridgewood). I bought these because they were substantially less expensive than the U.S. made tools. After filing the cast-iron in places, and relocating some screws and brackets, the tools work pretty good, although the fit and finish is not up to the quality of the better U.S. made (Delta/Powermatic/General) tools, in my opinion. When I recently looked at user reviews for the Dewalt 788 scroll saw on Amazon.com, I saw the same thing; Some people loved the saw, some people had to return it and get a 2nd or 3rd unit to find one that was properly manufactured, and others decided to file the blade cutout hole so that the blade doesn't rub against the table top. I believe that the Dewalt is a great design, but for $500, the saw shouldn't leave the factory with the blade rubbing against the metal table top.

I decided that I want a saw that doesn't have these sort of issues. The Excalibur looks like a great saw, but when General bought out Sommerville a few years ago, they moved the manufacturing of that saw from Canada to the far east, so I fear the same problems may happen with that saw. General also slashed the warranty from 5 years to two.

I am also considering Hegner but I have heard that Hawk and Eclipse have better after-the-sale customer service (although hopefully I won't need it).

Sorry for the long answer.
-Alan

[lucky788scroller]

No, dont be sorry for the long answer.Its all valid information, and I agree with you . The quality does suffer when production is moved to third world countries. Of the two you have narrowed it down to, you cant go wrong I dont think with either one.If it were me, it would be the blue one!
So, Bridgewood must be comparable to Harbor Freight??I almost bought a bridgewood jointer a few years back before I stumbled upon an unpassable deal on a grizzly (another foriegn manufacturer, although I have had no trouble with any of my grizzly tools). Dale

[RocketMan]

Originally Posted by RocketMan

Dale,
When I recently looked at user reviews for the Dewalt 788 scroll saw on Amazon.com, I saw the same thing; Some people loved the saw, some people had to return it and get a 2nd or 3rd unit to find one that was properly manufactured, and others decided to file the blade cutout hole so that the blade doesn't rub against the table top. I believe that the Dewalt is a great design, but for $500, the saw shouldn't leave the factory with the blade rubbing against the metal table top.
-Alan

Dale,
I just re-read your post and realize that the Dewalt saw that I was commenting on is the one that you own. I do scrolling as a hobby and am not currently selling my work, so it would be nice not to spend more money than I need to but at the same time to get something substantially better than my Delta 40-560 16", which is not a great saw. Was your Dewalt saw made in Canada or Taiwan?

-Alan