Art vs. Craft--More Examples

[Chase]

This is mainly for Janette, but since we have a recent interest in the art vs. crafts discussion I’ll post it for all.

Have all of you seen Jeanette’s web site. If you haven’t, go to it and marvel. This is one talented lady. I give her work a double WOW! Maybe that’s why she is our intarsia moderator.

Attachment 1 is a painting of our 1st schnauzer, Clyde. We were at an art/crafts show in the mall in Springfield up in Northern Virginia when I was doing my Pentagon thing back in ‘81 or ‘82. It was a high-end show. This lady, from Virginia Beach, had a display booth with all kinds of pet paintings for sale. We asked if she did consignments and with her affirmative response we left a wallet size pic of Clyde with her. Asked her if she wanted a deposit and she said, “no I’ve haven’t been stiffed yet.” I seem to remember the cost was $125. A few months later this oil painting on a slab of walnut arrived. I call this art. What say you?

Clyde v6.jpg

The second attachment is more recent.

Blanca Flg.jpg


Our current schnauzer, Blanca, is the subject (attch 3).

Blanca Tall.jpg

This lady who called herself Katydid had a booth at a local arts and crafts fair in the park. She had a display and a lot of flags of all types. We asked if she did pets?
After her affirmative answer she gave us her card. Via e-mail I sent a pic and you can see the resulting flag, cost $35. Art or craft? I say craft. What say you?

Submitted by Chase

[Jediscroller]

I'd call them both different examples of craftsmanship. Neither is original and both are based on photos. It requires technical proficiency with paint, and frankly, in my opiniion neither is particularly well done. Does it affect the value of the respective pieces in any way whatever you want to call them? I don't believe so.

[Chase]

I've posted a better qual photo of the slab painting. The cell phone resolution wasn't that good.

Disagree with the slab not being well done. No argument on the flag. If fact I'd call the flag a novelty.

Chase

[Jediscroller]

Originally Posted by Chase

I've posted a better qual photo of the slab painting. The cell phone resolution wasn't that good.

Disagree with the slab not being well done. No argument on the flag. If fact I'd call the flag a novelty.

Chase

Hence why there will likely never be a universal agreement as to the definition of art. It is a better photo, but like the digital phone commercials around here, it didn't change the content of the photo, hehehehehe. I do agree that the slab is better than the flag but it's not something that appeals to me.

[PuzzledMoose]

I'm not keen on the flag but I must admit I like the painting on the slab.

Kevin, why do you say the painting isn't original? Do you mean because it's beeen copied from a photograph? If so, then what's the difference between that and an arist painting a model, or a landscape ..?

Cute mutt BTW Chase ..

[Jediscroller]

Originally Posted by PuzzledMoose

Kevin, why do you say the painting isn't original? Do you mean because it's beeen copied from a photograph? If so, then what's the difference between that and an arist painting a model, or a landscape ..?

As a photographer, I see a photo as the art, not a derivative work based on the original (and yes, I feel the same way about scrollsaw patterns). When someone paints from nature, they are creating the photograph with their eye. I know, a thin line, but in my mind a line none-the-less. There's one very high end art and craft fair near me that makes the same distinction. Paintings based on photos are not permitted (and neither is woodwork based on photos).

[Janette]

I like the painting very much.

I'll have to disagree Kevin. I think "art" can be based on a photograph - since it's an interpretation of something-whether sitting outside looking at it -or a picture of it. Many fine fine artists photograph their subject to use as a reference to paint. I did a lot of photography before getting into intarsia.

I've seen many versions of pet portraits too - both in wood and other media and some are definitely art - some not so much. I've seen quite a few intarsia people who do pet portraits and other custom work too. Some isn't done terribly well at all and some exceptional.

I've always been "artsy" and could copy a photo in pencil, oils, etc. etc. I personally, at the time didn't feel it was art because I was copying it. When I started doing it in wood - that's when I got my "AH HA" moment. Making pieces of wood look just like someone's pet is a challenge. Anyone can make a pattern, but there needs to be some talent to make it look like what it's supposed to. (not talking about the computer made ones here). It also takes talent and practice (and some say a gift) to turn that pattern into a finished piece that you can be proud of.

[JohnB]

G'day Chase,
I like the plaque painting and I'd call it art, banner is a novelty item, in my opinion.

I'd also have to disagree with Kevin, regarding photo's being used as subjects for paintings, making those paintings not art. A lot of Artists actually use camera to take photos of subjects which they intend to paint later.
It equates to the old masters taking lots of sketches in note books prior to actually doing the piece, I'm sure that if they'd had a camera they'd have used it.

[Jediscroller]

'Tis ok, it would be a boring world if we all agreed. I know I'm definately in the minority on my views on this (other than several of the high end fair jury requirements around here).
I think our tastes play a role in our opinions as well. When I think of my favorite pieces of art that I own, neither could be based on a photo (J. Kugler's Serengeti and Mort Kunstler's Confederate Winter). I couldn't find a pic of these particular pieces on the web, but an example of Kugler's style can be seen here. It's in this style but with a lion superimposed on the scene. Mort Kunstler's work can be seen here. To me, this is art.

[JohnB]

Originally Posted by Jediscroller

'SNIP here. It's in this style but with a lion superimposed on the scene. Mort Kunstler's work can be seen here. To me, this is art.

Now Kevin, you have me agreeing with you, that is definitely "ART" IMHO

But, I'm sure that Mr Kunstler never met Abe so he obviously based his likeness on photographs. I rest my case

Ieper, The Menin Gate - Menin Gate at Midnight
This is also art
and this
Artist's Footsteps
I have prints of both these and they are my favourite pieces "Down on his Luck" is my absolute fav.