Soap Soak Re-Visited

[William Young]

I tried the soap soak several years ago with very little success and I have found that the 24 hour alcohol soak works best fro me. But recently , Rick Hutcheson pointed out that he uses a four day dish-washing detergent soak while I had only tried a one day soak . Perhaps that was my mistake when I tried it . So I am trying it again because it costs less than alcohol and even has a nice lemon smell

Here are three N E bowls I rough turned yesterday afternoon and they are in a pail with a 50/50 mix of dish detergent and water .



And here is a picture of what is actually in the pail. I took them out just for a photo opp . . LOL . . . and then put them back in.



Here are a few N E bowls that were alcohol soaked a few weeks ago and wrapped with brown paper bags like I normally do.
They are almost dry now because they are very light in weight.
I have had great success with the denatured alcohol soak especially with these NE bowls because the bark has stayed firmly affixed .
I am anxious to see if the soap soaked ones has any effect on the bark staying on or if the soap will loosen it.
Even if it loosens and comes off , all the wood was free so I won't be out anything but my time.





Rick;
If you are following this, would you wrap them like with the alcohol method when taking them out or just leave them in the open air. How long after being removed from the four day soak would you think they would be dry and ready to final turn and finish. ?
W.Y.

[Rick H]

I have not wrapped them after. Just set them on the table to dry for 4-7 days. I don't weigh them but when they feel dry I finish turn them.

[Marsha]

OK I gotta ask, 1st, what does NE mean, and why are you soaking them?
Marsha

[Gaia]

N E = Natural Edge?
Just a guess to see if my brain is working this morning.

[lucky788scroller]

yup, natural edge, bark still intact.

[William Young]

Sorry for the late response. Spent the morning at the hospital again with wife due to complications with her recent surgery .

Yes , the N E question has been addressed . Thanks

Marsha.
Why soaking them ? ?

These are rounds of juicy green wood when turning them. It is SO much easier to hog out all that wood inside a green bowl than with a dry one. However, if they were left untreated they would crack badly and become useless. We rough turn them to within 10% of their final shape and size. Then they are allowed to dry *without cracking* by any one of various methods . Some methods take 6 months or ever longer whereas other methods like denatured alcohol or the detergent soak reduces the waiting time to just a couple weeks and they are put back on the lathe and final turned.
Some of the slower methods give about a 25% failure rate over a period of about 6 months . Some turners don't mind that because it is free wood anyway. With the two methods mentioned here I have had better than 5% failure rate so even though the wood is free, I still save a lot of time in the long run.
W.Y.

[minowevie]

Hi Bill, I just had to show hubby this thread, He never new about soaking the bowls. His bowls always crack. and he, just seals them with some putty. but I love this tip.
My quistion would be . can you use the alcohol wash again, or is a one time thing. that would be exspencive. and what kind of soap would you use. any or a special one. also. what does the papper bag do. obsorb the moster?? and why brown papper bags. also, what do you do with them after you finish turning them. are they good to go as is. or will they still crak?. is there something you put on them to help in that way? thanks your friend Evie.

[William Young]

Evie.
Either the alcohol or the soap can be used over and over and over. There is some used up in the process and a little lost by evaporation but it only needs to be topped up when it gets down .

It is ordinary dish washing detergent that is used and the cheapest you can find at the dollar store is just fine.

The paper bag open as shown on the inside part just slows the drying process a little and prevents war-page to a certain degree . The opening prevents mold from forming DAMHIKT . Apparently the soap method does not require any type of wrapping so that is why I am trying it again as per my opening message as soap soak re-visited.

After they are put on the lathe and they are turned to the desired thickness you put your choice of finish on them whether it be lacquer or polyurethane or wax ore one of the various kinds of oil finish. Sometimes it depends what the bowl is going to be used for that determines what kind of finish is applied .

No . . it will not crack after it is dry and final turned and finished. It should last indefinitely.

Here are some three year old elm bowls that I turned green with the alcohol drying method. Elm is one of the worst woods for warping and cracking but there is no trace of it on them.

W.Y.

[minowevie]

Bill , I thank you so much, showed this to hubby, and he is trilled. the one thing I was also wondering, I know you said it already, but just wont to be clear. how do you know when it is dry enouph to turn again, you said light enouph. is that a feel thing? or color??? do you have a day or week thing you go buy. we live in the hight desert. whitch is so dry. do you think we should soak alittle more, or mmmm rap more. or. it will dry pretty fast. so do you think something would be differant in are area. dry area? thanks much. your friend Evie. Ps. this is not just for hubby, as you know. I would like to get into that art myself.

[William Young]

Evie.
If I want to turn them real soon, I will start weighing them on my wifes kitchen scales. They will loose weight dramatically in the first three or four days. Not much point in weighing them at that time except for out of curiosity to see how much it has changed. After about 1.5 weeks I start weighing them and recording the weight each time. As soon as they have not lost any weight for 4 consecutive days they are considered dry and ready to put back on the lathe and finish off. Of course if you are not in a hurry to finish them, any old time after that is just fine.

Neither the alcohol or the soap will affect the color of the wood. Even though the alcohol does change to a darker color it will not change the natural color of the wood.

Remember . . . the alcohol is used full strength and the dish washing detergent is used mixed with water at at 50/50 ratio.
Also don't rough turn any less than 10% of the projected end result (wall thickness) but have the wall thickness the same from top to bottom before soaking and drying. e.g, . . . a ten inch bowl would be rough turned to 1" wall thickness. The reason for this is the ANY method of drying whether it be two weeks or 6 months will result in some warping so when you put it back on the lathe you will be able to turn the warp out and still have a thinner but uniform thickness bowl.

N E bowls are more fun to turn than plain edge bowls and they sell about 10 times as fast for more than double the price of just "regular" bowls . That is why , when I turn plain bowls I like to dress them up a little (especially plain grain ones) to add a little uniqueness as shown below in a couple that were almost the full size diameter that my lathe was capable of handling. .

You might have to experiment a little with soak times and dry times in the desert.
Where I live in the Rocky Mountains it is dryer than a lot of other areas of Canada but not as dry as your desert condition.
Let us know how you make out when you try it.
W.Y.