Making crosses level: the saga continues

[Cutting Cathy]

Ok I am now pulling my hair out trying to get this right!! Please forgive my long post!! I've become so frustrated that I told my husband I just needed to quit scrolling and sell all my stuff!! I even printed John B's instructions to go off of! I positioned the cross on the base and drew around it with a pencil. Drilled a hole and then scrolled the square out. That's when the problems started. I tried fitting the cross into the base and it was too tight. Worked on it a little, sanding here and there, tried fitting it in again, busted the cross into several pieces! Well, that's ok, I had 4 of them cut, I'll just move along to the next one. After what seemed like forever, I've gotten 2 of them to fit, but I can see gaps!!! Here is picture of the bottom of the two:

crosses bottom.jpg

I put them on the scanner and held a flashlight over them to show you the light coming through the gaps:

crosses.jpg

And here is just one of them. This is what it looks like from the bottom, with no light against the back:

crosses4.jpg

But here it is with a light shining behind it:

crosses gap.jpg

You can see the light shining through the gap!!! And I tried to take a pictures of it from the other side and I can still tell there is a gap:

cross base.jpg

In my original thread Making crosses level Kevin (Fremmed) tried this and his looks perfect!! How?!?!?! Maybe I'm making too much of this. And now I have just realized that I'm still not square on one of them:

cross2.jpg

Any suggestions??? Is there any hope for me or should I start packing up the shop to list on Ebay? Thanks so much for taking the time to read all this and help!!!

Cathy in NE

[sawdustus]

Don't quit Cathy. The cross is beautiful and worth the effort to attach it to the base.

I presume that you will want to glue the little tenon (the peg you cut sticking out of the bottom of the cross) into the mortise (the hole that you cut in the base). When you do, the little tiny gaps will disappear as if by magic.

Unless you use a mortising attachment (expensive and tough to set up) in your drill press or a dedicated mortiser (even more expensive) and then use a tenoning jig (expensive) on your table saw to cut the tenon to the exact size of the mortise you cut, it is not possible to get them to fit perfectly without a bit of fussing.

I usually try to cut the tenon a bit (1/32 or so) long and then after the glue dries, sanding off the little bit that sticks out the bottom to level the entire piece and get it to stand vertically. If you end up sanding 1/64 or less off one side or corner of the base to achieve this, it will not be noticeable to anyone but you. The top will draw attention away from any imperfections in the base. I do this frequently when making small mini-clocks and the top is not wide or thick enough for small screws to be used to hold it to the base. I also find that if I cut the tenon before I scroll, I can then use the tenon to center the top and then mark the tenon edges on the base to outline the mortise before drilling a starter hole and scrolling the mortise out. I stay inside the line and use a small flat file or sandpaper on a flat stick to smooth out the rectangular hole. This lets me fit the tenon into the mortise with the smallest gaps possible. Glue takes care of the rest.

I hope this helps.

[sawdustus]

Cathy,

After I posted my reply, I realized that you were using the entire post of the cross to act as the tenon. This makes it more difficult to hide the gaps. If you cut the bottom of the cross longer than you need and then cut a tenon that is smaller in cross section than the bottom of the cross, you will create a tenon that will fit into the mortise and the lip around the bottom of the cross will hide any gaps that otherwise would be visible from the top.

In other words, If your cross is 1" x 1" in cross section and you remove about 1/8" from each side to create the tenon, you will never see the gaps from the top. Any such proportions will work. Again, a bit of sanding will take care of any irregularities.

[JohnB]

G'day Cathy,
You've done alright. You know there's a gap because you cut it, and that's the important part "YOU CUT IT" so it's a hand crafted piece. Stop beating yourself up for being human, if perfection was required nothing would ever get done. As my Dad would say "Know when to leave well enough alone".
You can straighten the cross by removing a little timber from the tenon on the left hand side, this will allow the top to move to the right.

AS George said, "Glue it up and it'll take care of it's self."

Don't panic to much about the bottom as it's the bottom and Georges idea of leaving a bit of the tenon proud then sanding back works for me.
Keep at it and as time goes by, you'll find that things like this will become easier and easier.
Don't kick yourself around the block, just have fun.

[Fremmed]

Hi Cathy

If you want to pack up all your stuff, just PM me and I'll give you an address you a can send to where it will be taken care of with all the love in the world. LOL

Ok, seriously. Your cuts don't look bad at all. When I tried John's tutorial (was it long enough to be called that?) I just made sure to cut it tight, inside the trace, and worked the base just a little at a time. A few of mine show gaps, but like John said, "You Cut It." Anybody that appreciates your work will understand it not being laser perfect.

Also, I have been putting a keyhole on the back "so you can remove it from the base and hang it on your wall." Takes the burden off making it perfect and lets the customer feel they can decide how to display it.

Hope that helps

Kevin

[Rolf]

I also think you are being a bit to hard on yourself. When you glue it mix a little sawdust the same color as the wood and smear it into the gap if it really bothers you.
Georges suggestion of a smaller tennon will solve your problem .

[Wood Dog]

Anyone who can cut that beautiful Corian trivet certainly should not give it all up over a tiny crack, but I know how you feel, you want it as perfect as you can get it. Stay with us Cutting Cathy.......the next one you try will be almost perfect.

[CanadianScroller]

Cathy they are beautiful pieces, I agree with what everyone is saying, each piece is hand crafted.
Sawdustus has a good point with the tenon. Hiding it under the edge.
If you glue the cross to the base you can cover the bottom with felt, no one would ever see a slight gap.
I personaly think that the slight variations in each project ensure it is hand crafted and not mass produced with a laser.
I think you have done a wonderful job with the crosses.

[Gill]

When you cut the mortice, Cathy, tilt your table very slightly, about 1/4 to 1/2 degree, although the precise angle will vary according to the thickness of wood you're using. Make sure you cut in the one direction to produce a mortice that is very slightly narrower at the bottom than at the top. If you need to cut in the other direction to square off the mortices, don't forget to tilt the table the other way!

This will get you a tight fit yet allow you a bit of play to align the cross while the glue in the joint cures.

Gill

[FRETDUST]

Hi kathy
Sorry to hear you are having those problems. I,ve made many of those crosses and attach them with a screw from the bottom. If you want to know how i do it just send me a e-mail.

Steve in Mi.